Vernal Equinox and Crowley

[maxomai]

So I have a question for you then. I mean no disrespect, please don't think I do. If you are a member of Thelema, do you believe in God? Or what else?
thanks
I am just curious....

theresa

I'm a Thelemite if that's what you mean.

I believe that every living thing is a reflection of God.

I believe that the Book of the Law is the new Revelation.

Your mileage may vary.

[tannhaus]

If you are a member of Thelema, do you believe in God? Or what else?

It depends on the Thelemite. There are Thelemites who are Christians, Wiccans, Muslims and probably whatever else. There are also Thelemites who are agnostic, such as myself, or atheist. In Thelema, your thoughts and choices aren't dictated to you. It's up to you to find out what you believe.

As far as whomever the poster was claiming Crowley was creepy...you should really find out what the man was like. He's no more creepy than the Pope...and probably less so to many people. There are a lot of fabrications out there about the man...

If you want, check out tannhaus.com. Under my writings I have a brief introduction to Thelema. Under Thelemic writings I have many of Crowley's writings. It may help.

[sororyzbl]

So I have a question for you then. I mean no disrespect, please don't think I do. If you are a member of Thelema, do you believe in God? Or what else?
thanks
I am just curious....

theresa

Thelema is a philosophy, like if I ask you if you are a member of Christian.

As for beliefs, it's complicated. I suggest reading the Book of the Law. In simple terms, yes I believe in a higher being.

[sororyzbl]

As far as whomever the poster was claiming Crowley was creepy...you should really find out what the man was like. He's no more creepy than the Pope...and probably less so to many people. There are a lot of fabrications out there about the man...

Dude, the new pope freaks me the hell out! most Catholic priests and Christian clergy kinda skeeve me, in reality. at least with Thelemite clergy, they're up front about their wierdness. You can trust in their honesty.

Of course there are exceptions, just as there are in Thelema. My brother's a Christian minister, and so far as I know he's an upstanding guy. Of course, I got stories to hell and back about his younger days, but that's do be expected LOL.

[theresascraps]

Thank you for your replies. I am always curious to learn new things. I appreciate it
theresa

[tannhaus]

Dude, the new pope freaks me the hell out! most Catholic priests and Christian clergy kinda skeeve me, in reality. at least with Thelemite clergy, they're up front about their wierdness. You can trust in their honesty.

Yeah...he does look like the Emperor from Star Wars. I think when most people call Crowley creepy they're either:
A. Believing all the fabrications about him...which just makes them look like fools. or
B. Oblivious to the fact their own clergy are far more creepy to others.

It's like the christians you meet with the big painted on smiles...*twitch*

[ApotheosisAZ]

This is merely a helpful reminder that the discussion here is meandering off-topic. No one admires the religious icons mentioned here more than myself, but the actual topic is "Vernal Equinox and Crowley."

So, I entreat those who wish to relate their feelings regarding the appearance of these religious icons to PM one another about the issue. Again, this is merely a reminder.

Thank you for your time.

[tannhaus]

This is merely a helpful reminder that the discussion here is meandering off-topic. No one admires the religious icons mentioned here more than myself, but the actual topic is "Vernal Equinox and Crowley."

Discussions here are actually supposed to stay on topic now?

[Ziola]

weird, isn't it? You'll get used to it....

[tannhaus]

Ok....here is the appropriate part from the commentary to the Book of the Law:

AL II,35: "Let the rituals be rightly performed with joy & beauty!"


The Old Comment
35. Let us be practical persons, not babblers of gossip and platitude.

The New Comment
A ritual is not a melancholy formality; it is a Sacrament, a Dance, a Commemoration of the Universe. The Universe is endless rapture, wild and unconfined, a mad passion of speed. Astronomers tell us this of the Great Republic of the Stars; physicists say the same of the Little Republic of Molecules. Shall not the Middle Republic of Men be like unto them? The polite ethicist demurs; his ideal is funereal solemnity. His horizon is bounded by death; and his spy-glass is smeared with the idea of sin. The New Aeon proclaims Man as Immortal God, eternally active to do His Will. All's Joy, all's Beauty; this Will we celebrate.
In this verse we see how the awakening leads to ordered and purposeful action. Joy and Beauty are the evidence that our functions are free and fit; when we take no pleasure, and find nothing to admire, in our work, we are doing it wrong.


AL II,36: "There are rituals of the elements and feasts of the times."


The Old Comment
36. A crescendo of ecstasy in the mere thought of performing these rituals; which are in preparation under the great guidance of V.V.V.V.V.

The New Comment
Each element -- fire, earth, air, water, and Spirit -- possesses its own Nature, Will, and Magical Formula. Each one may then have its appropriate ritual. Many such in crude form are described in The Golden Bough of Dr. J.G. Frazer, the Glory of Trinity!
In particular the entry of the Sun into the cardinal signs of the elements at the Equinoxes and Solstices are suitable for festivals.

The difference between 'rituals' and 'feasts' is this: by the one a particular form of energy is generated, while there is a general discharge of one's superfluous force in the other. Yet a feast implies periodical nourishment.


AL II,37: "A feast for the first night of the Prophet and his Bride!"


The New Comment
There should be a special feast on the 12th day of August in every year, since it was the marriage of The Beast which made possible the revelation of the New Law. (This is not an Apology for Marriage. Hard Cases make Bad Law).

AL II,38: "A feast for the three days of the writing of the Book of the Law."


The New Comment
This is April 8th, 9th, and 10th, the feast beginning at High Noon.

AL II,39: "A feast for Tahuti and the child of the Prophet-secret, O Prophet!"


The New Comment
This particular feast is of a character suited only to initiates.

AL II,40: "A feast for the Supreme Ritual, and a feast for the Equinox of the Gods."


The New Comment
The Supreme Ritual is the Invocation of Horus, which brought about the Opening of the New Aeon. The date is March 20.
The Equinox of the Gods is the term used to describe the Beginning of a New Aeon, or a New Magical Formula. It should be celebrated at every Equinox, in the manner known to Neophytes of the A.'.A..'.


AL II,41: "A feast for fire and a feast for water; a feast for life and a greater feast for death!"


The New Comment
The feasts of fire and water indicate rejoicings to be made at the puberty of boys and girls respectively.
The feast for life is at a birth; and the feast for death at a death. It is of the utmost importance to make funerals merry, so as to train people to take the proper view of death. The fear of death is one of the great weapons of tyrants, as well as their scourge; and it distorts our whole outlook upon the Universe.

So...now you have all the feast days.

[girlAnachronism]

Great points brought up by everyone here. I do think that 3/20 will (or should) play some importance in the upcoming weeks. Though I agree with whoever brought up the fact that the ceremony is supposed to occur only once in a long time. So I don't think it could be THE ceremony, but I wouldn't be surprised if some of Jonas's cabin neighbors start dancing around in robes.

Completely off topic, but what if the eye was a housewarming gift from a family friend/neighbor?

[longlostposter]

I was thinking, perhaps the practice ceremony was meant to be just that...practice, and this is why they haven't touched Bree since she went on the run. When the time comes, they will take her, maybe?

[JustAnotherLonelyGirl.]

I have a question for the Thelemites too. First of all, let me say that I find Thelema very agreeable and interesting. I've always been skeptical of religion and this one is among few that I find myself understanding how anyone could actually believe in it. (This is meant as a compliment, so please don't misread anything I'm saying.)

Anyway, I've been trying to understand exactly what Aleister Crowley did. Did he found Thelema? Or did he simply introduce the themes that eventually led to Thelema? A lot of other belief systems have stemmed out of Crowley's teachings, so I don't quite understand if Thelema is just one among many, the original one, or an inclusion of them all.

As for Bree's "religion," do a lot of "secret societies" branch out of Thelema? Do you see this as a realistic possibility? Or is it totally ludicrous? Do many of these societies view Crowley with such admiration?

Again, don't feel insulted by anything I say. I know religion can be a touchy subject for people in general, but I'd like to remind you that I genuinely respect your beliefs. I don't mean to sound ignorant or skeptical.

[tannhaus]

Anyway, I've been trying to understand exactly what Aleister Crowley did. Did he found Thelema? Or did he simply introduce the themes that eventually led to Thelema? A lot of other belief systems have stemmed out of Crowley's teachings, so I don't quite understand if Thelema is just one among many, the original one, or an inclusion of them all.

Well, first I'd be curious as to which belief systems you consider to have stemmed out of Crowley's teachings. I'm just curious.

As to what Crowley did, he did a lot of cocaine and heroin...buggered grown men..and grown women...and apparently ate lots of curry...

Oh, you don't mean that....

Crowley was the prophet of Thelema. He declared the law of Thelema to the world. He basically started the religion. You can read a lot of his writings at http://www.tannhaus.com under Thelemic writings. Now, a lot of the ideas espoused in Thelema were not his original ideas. But, he made a congruent whole of it all. Also, as Thelemites, we are individuals. Just because Crowley said it doesn't make it true. You can and will disagree with Crowley on something. We all do.

As for Bree's "religion," do a lot of "secret societies" branch out of Thelema? Do you see this as a realistic possibility? Or is it totally ludicrous? Do many of these societies view Crowley with such admiration?

Well, Thelema comes out of a long line of Western mystery traditions. A lot of the concepts and methods you find practiced by Thelemites actually came from these traditions. Among those practices you will find the Qabalah, the tarot, astrology, skrying, magick, etc. Among those Western mystery traditions you will find the Rosicrucians, the Illuminati, the Golden Dawn, the Theosophical Society, the Freemasons, etc. So, it's only natural for Thelema itself to produce mystery schools of its own...aka secret societies.

As far as viewing Crowley with admiration, you'd have to be a screwed up individual to do so. Crowley had social problems out the wazoo. Also, while he was progressive in many ways, he still had a long way to come. For his time, he was a progressive individual. For now, he shouldn't be idolized, but instead you should take into account the time period he was from and disregard any backwards ideas you find. Many people see Crowley the man and Crowley the prophet as two different personas pretty much.

I don't mean to sound ignorant or skeptical.

Skepticism is good. Don't believe everything you hear or read. Think things over and come to your own conclusions.

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