We could probably use a more efficient front page. While the page works well as an index for those of us who are familiar with the wiki, it's not as welcoming as it could be for new users. In addition, it'd be nice to have a wiki front page that looked more like lonelygirl15 and less like Wikipedia. So jump in -- share ideas about content/features/style, etc. you'd like to see on the LGPedia front page.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 21:55, 11 December 2006 (CST)

:Awesome use of the seldom used sub-page feature of MediaWiki. I am very eager to see what ideas editors can come up with for a new main page layout -- [[User:Twjaniak|Twjaniak]] 22:41, 11 December 2006 (CST)

Sorry I was gone so much lately, I've got three jobs, two kids and Christmas shopping to take care of, so I hope you'll understand if I'm not always here. (One of my coworkers asked me, "When do you sleep?!" I replied, "Um...never?") Anyway, this is a great idea for a page, and I'll leave some feedback on this stuff, which is looking pretty good.--[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 14:46, 12 December 2006 (CST)

== The video column ==

My basic idea for a video column is to put the newest video at the top. That way you see the newest information first, keeps the page more dynamic. And also, to incorporate small pictures from videos (to make the front page more visual) and to include non-video, but still important events, on this list. What do people think of the basic idea?--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 23:13, 11 December 2006 (CST)

:I do like it! Do you think it's going to be a lot more work to update it now though? It looks kind of advanced... [[User:OwenIsCool|OwenIsCool]] 23:53, 11 December 2006 (CST)

::I think we can build some basic templates to make all the formatting automatic. If we do that, it should be pretty easy. If we're using a template, we can even add a quick note to explain how to add the newest video. But we'll see, if it ends up being too complicated, we can always stick with the current list.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 00:04, 12 December 2006 (CST)

:great, i was coming here to suggest that myself!--[[User:Skeeta|Skeeta]] 22:09, 13 December 2006 (CST)

Perhaps the video column should be called '''Latest News''' or something to that effect, since any new video would be news in the LG15 world. Labeling the column like this would allow us to put things there that go beyond just video, such as blurbs regarding GoodGollyItsHolly's decision. -- [[User:Twjaniak|Twjaniak]] 10:10, 12 December 2006 (CST)

:Yeah, good idea. I changed it and like it. I also think we should try to make the style sets look more like lonelygirl15.com, (blues and grays), and less like wikipedia, (greenish).--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 13:17, 12 December 2006 (CST)

::I like the idea of having a column that has the "latest news" rather than videos. Now that the list is getting very long, I think it might be good to move it off the page. In general, I like the idea of changing things to be less text and more visuals, in general making the page a bit shorter. Keep only the latest videos and main topics on the front page, and move lesser items to index pages. --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 14:46, 12 December 2006 (CST)

:::Personally, I think you should keep "videos" and "news" in different columns. It just adds to the confusion, and I agree with Brucker that the page should be, if not as short as possible, significantly shorter than the current main page. --[[User:Demosthenesdown|Demosthenesdown]] 18:07, 14 December 2006 (CST)

::::By news we only mean -- news related to the lonelygirl15 story. Bree chat, for example, is the perfect example. Since the lonelygirl15 story is not told exclusively through videos, it's important that an event like Bree chat goes into the chronology on the Main Page. Something like a story ''about'' the lonelygirl15 production in Wired Magazine would not go on the list. That's not what we mean by news.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 20:50, 14 December 2006 (CST)

::::: Things become much clearer now... Thanks Jay, or Henry, or whatever...--[[User:Demosthenesdown|Demosthenesdown]] 01:18, 15 December 2006 (CST)

== Characters column ==

To echo your feel of the video column, how about heading the characters column with something like this. Anyone like? [[User:OwenIsCool|OwenIsCool]] 23:54, 11 December 2006 (CST)
{| align=left style="width:300px" border=2
|-
|colspan=42 align=center style="background:#99CCFF; color:black"|'''''Main characters'''''
|-
| style="background:white"|[[Image:Vid22.jpg|150px]]
| style=background:white|[[Image:Daniel.jpg|150px]]
|-
|align=center style="background:white"| '''[[Bree]]'''
|align=center style=background:white| '''[[Daniel]]'''
|-
|style="background:white|[[Image:Gemma_background.jpg|150px]]
|style="background:white|[[Image:MNIJonas.gif|150px]]
|-
|align=center style=background:white| '''[[Gemma]]'''
|align=center style=background:white| '''[[Jonas]]'''
|-
|}
<br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br>
:See, now this is a very nice idea, but perhaps just a bit smaller. As I said before about major info staying on tha main page and more minor info going elsewhere, I think showing a small picture of every main character (bloggers only) with a link below to "supporting cast" or "other official characters" would be nice. --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 14:46, 12 December 2006 (CST)

::I tried adding in a modified version of the characters box. It doesn't look right at all for now, but it's an idea of what it might look like. If we don't use the box on the main page, it'd definitely be a nice touch for a characters page.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 16:21, 13 December 2006 (CST)

:::That was a good try. I like it better than the current main page and better than what I made. Yeah, it might need some work (like it should be centered, prob)... but I like the direction that we're headed in, both for this col and for the videos. [[User:OwenIsCool|OwenIsCool]] 22:38, 13 December 2006 (CST)

Ok, so I've given more thought to the characters column (with everything that falls below it) and what should be changed going forward. Here's a little list I came up with... sorry it's so long and doesn't illustrate anything. I think we have huge potential to save valuable space if we just implement a few of these changes.
*Have a nice little table with the pics of the bloggers and links to their pages
*Other characters
**Mention Lucy, Bree's mom and dad, P. Monkey, Owen, Thor with links to their pages.
**Leave out Deacon (individual), Watcher, The Other Monkey, Cassie, Paul, Andrea, The Deacons (so redundant, but it's there), Gemma's flatmate. While these people certainly exist, there's too little to be said about them to really merit mention on the main page. Maybe we need a character's page with another nice looking set-up in which we can include everyone... and we can link to that. That way we can include everyone.
*Leave out Ambiguous Mystery People heading and Bukanator... it was current a long time ago, but not so relevant anymore, I don't think
*Link to article [[The Creators]], but not to each individual profile (make sure there are links to all of them in the article)
*Production Team - also link to article and not all the individual people (we can write one if we don't have a suitable one yet)
*Link to [[Bree's religion]], but ''not'' to individual articles for [[Aleister Crowley|Crowley]], [[Thelema]], [[Denderah]], [[The Order]], the [[Watcher]], and [[Bree's religion - more speculation]]. Again, we can make sure that the Bree's religion article is comprehensive enough and has all these links in it.
*I'm not sure what to do with the locations pages... I don't think they are too valuable to newcomers, but perhaps we can link to a central Locations page that lists all these pages so ppl can explore if they want.
*lonelygirl.com site features - very important. I would display the forums, chat room, and LGpedia links more prominently.
*Official ARG should link to just AphidPedia, no need for separate OpAphid and Tachyon links now.
*Unofficial spin-offs - link to some page that lists all the significant ones, but not list them individually... and leave cassieiswatching out altogether maybe?
*Leave related sites links to Children of Anchor Cove, YouTube and Revver
*Alternate reality games - just leave link to ARG tools?
*Music - link to ccMixter, new music page and to the (soon to be) soundtrack!
[[User:OwenIsCool|OwenIsCool]] 01:47, 15 December 2006 (CST)

== New vid feature ==

Okay, so again, just an idea. Since [[User_Talk:OwenIsCool|OwenIsCool]] expressed some concern that a new template might be confusing... At the bottom of the page, I added a link that says "add new video." If you click on the link, it takes you directly to the video column, and even provides instructions on how to add the text. It's just a rough example of how it could work, but using templates I think we could make it pretty easy for any registered user to quickly add the newest video.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 13:47, 12 December 2006 (CST)

I'm going to make a lot of repetitive edits to the page to add a notation system to make it easier to edit in the future. So that my edits don't interfere with the [[Special:recentchanges]] page, I'm going to make my edits as a bot. If you want to see the changes I'm making, you can always check the history of this page, or you can click on the "show bots" tab in the recent changes.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 15:12, 13 December 2006 (CST)

== Just In General ==

I was wondering if it is actually necessary to include ALL the information on the front page. It might be enough to link to certain catagories. Sure, listing the main characters (Bree, Gemma, Daniel, Jonas) is okay, but what about characters with very little airtime (Lucy, or the Deacon/Deacons) not to mention the space that all this stuff takes up. If you could just link to a characters portal page (or whatever it's called, my tech terms as you might be able to tell are limited) and from there jump to more specific catagories or direct characters, it would save space, and it would make the whole thing less confusing. Also the video column, to me at least, seems like a good idea, but what if you listed, with that little jpg preview (i like that) the name of the most recent video and then the description and the "author"/character. and then maybe, using only titles (like the current main page) listed the last three? there are about a million ways to do all this, but this was just my input. Of course I can't really edit things so these are all suggestions. --[[User:Demosthenesdown|Demosthenesdown]] 21:41, 13 December 2006 (CST)

:Yeah, I agree with almost every idea Demosthenes says. There's really no need to include something like [[Deacons (commenters)]] so prominently. If we could eventually pare down the page, so that very little scrolling is required to get to the bottom of it I think that'd be ideal. Of course, it will take some work to get the various portal pages up, but I think it's a good general idea for the direction we want to take this.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 21:53, 13 December 2006 (CST)

::As I said above, I think the main page should be considerably smaller. As was discussed elsewhere, I the HRWiki is an excellent example in the way they do so much. Look at their [http://www.hrwiki.org/index.php/Main_Page main page], and see how compact it is. I see no reason why our main page couldn't have a similar compactness. Rather than tossing up a link to every piece of information, there could be links to pages with lists of other links. We can have that little picture thing, followed by a single link to "Official Characters", a single link to "Locations", a single link to "spin-offs" or whatever. I think the main page should about one-third the size it currently is, if not more like one-quarter. --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 19:09, 14 December 2006 (CST)

::: Yeah, single links to pages that are more specific, and not everything just dashed together on one page. --[[User:Demosthenesdown|Demosthenesdown]] 01:20, 15 December 2006 (CST)

== Featured Article ==

What do people think of having a featured article of the week on the main page? It's common on a lot of wikis. I personally like the idea, because it could circulate interesting pages that otherwise people might not find. What do others think?--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 23:00, 14 December 2006 (CST)

:I like that a lot! I think a week is a good time period. It's a great idea and we should figure out what sort of minimum quality standards an article must meet, and who gets to decide each week. [[User:OwenIsCool|OwenIsCool]] 23:04, 14 December 2006 (CST)

::I like it too, but as you said what are the criteria? Who decides? Theres a lot to do in order to have this idea work, certain pages would need to be cleaned up, others might need to be trimmed down. It would be a lot of work, but I think it's a cool idea, good enough to merit the work. --[[User:Demosthenesdown|Demosthenesdown]] 01:24, 15 December 2006 (CST)

:::I've seen a few other wikis that do it. Basically they just discuss and vote. We could do it at the [[LGPedia:Community Portal|Community Portal]]. I think once a week is a schedule we'd be able to keep up with. We could do it batting order style. We could have the featured article on the main page. Then we have an article on deck for next week -- that everybody chips in to make really good. Then we could have a couple articles that we're considering for two weeks out.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 02:22, 15 December 2006 (CST)

::::I think its a good idea to have that pipe-line like idea. It means that you can have all the work focused on just one or two articles. --[[User:Demosthenesdown|Demosthenesdown]] 09:05, 15 December 2006 (CST)

== ACTION! ==

Let's put some of this into use! I'm going to start with the Characters info.--[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 11:46, 20 December 2006 (CST)

== Color scheme ==

Since one of the goals of the redesign project was to make the main page look less like Wikipedia and more like Lonelygirl15, I thought maybe we should give some thought to our color scheme. Right now the main page uses pastels reminiscent of Wikipedia. When we redesign it, we should try to use colors that mimic the LG15 website (much like we've used templates to mimic user's YouTube profiles. I put together a table of html colors that to me look like the ones on LG15. Feel free to add better colors as seen fit! [[User:OwenIsCool|OwenIsCool]] 12:27, 20 December 2006 (CST)
(I removed my table since Brucker's had the official colors used on LG15 website)

Here's the actual color palette of the top of the main page:

{| align=left style="width:300px" border=2
|-
|colspan=42 align=center style="background:white; color:black"|'''''Color scheme'''''
|-
| style="background:white"|'''Sample'''
| style="background:white"|'''HTML Color name'''
|-
| style="background:#1E5DAA"|
| style="background:white"|background (1E5DAA)
|-
| style="background:#77C8E5"|
| style="background:white"|"A tribute to" (77C8E5)
|-
| style="background:#6FC6E3"|
| style="background:white"|"15" (6FC6E3)
|-
| style="background:#204C9F"|
| style="background:white"|Circles of dots (204C9F)
|-
| style="background:#2574C4"|
| style="background:white"|Light blue details (2574C4)
|-
| style="background:#1B5FB7"|
| style="background:white"|Faint dark blue flowers and circles (1B5FB7)
|-
| style="background:#2450AE"|
| style="background:white"|Bright blue unicursal hex (2450AE)
|-
| style="background:#1E6BBF"|
| style="background:white"|Center circle of flower (1E6BBF)
|-
| style="background:#535353"|
| style="background:white"|Navigation bar (535353)
|-
| style="background:#909090"|
| style="background:white"|Stars on the bar (909090)
|-
|}
<br><br><br><br><br>
These are eight different shades of blue and two greys, and there are no "standard" colors in there. Can anyone fix the formatting of these boxes? --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 14:08, 20 December 2006 (CST)

I tried to fix it. Maybe there's a better way to do it but for now I guess this will do. I also took down my table since it takes up space and yours has the real colors anyway. [[User:OwenIsCool|OwenIsCool]] 14:30, 20 December 2006 (CST)

I added the hex triplets for ease of reference.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 14:08, 21 December 2006 (CST)

I love this new color scheme around the characters box!--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 16:20, 21 December 2006 (CST)

<br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br>

== Pictures/Staff ==

I think we need to find new pictures of Gemma and Jonas. For whatever reason, both of them have shorter vertical distances which makes them look slightly akward compared to Bree and Daniel. If we can't find them images that match the other two, then we need to crop the Bree and Daniel pictures so they're all the same size.

Another thing: I think we should group the Creators and Production Staff (and possibly even [[Bukanator]])) together in one group. This would save the space it takes to divide them all into seperate catagories. Plus, there's really no need to make the distinction on the main page, is there? We can call the new catagory "LG15 Staff" or "Creators & Production Staff" - whatever works. --[[User:TheNunOwnedGoat|Andy]] 13:36, 20 December 2006 (CST)

:Okay, I got the sizes all the same. Does anyone think that the Jonas picture still looks odd, though?--[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 14:25, 20 December 2006 (CST)

::Thanks, looks great! It seems like the Jonas video is just a low-quality picture. Most of the pictures have been like that, though, recently. At least in my opinion. --[[User:TheNunOwnedGoat|Andy]] 15:52, 20 December 2006 (CST)

Okay, while I agree that the new Gemma picture is a better picture of her, the cropping is very bad. We really need consitency here. --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 14:36, 21 December 2006 (CST)

:Agree with Brucker, especially on the front page. We need somebody to get 4 good screenshots of Jonas, Gemma, Daniel and Bree -- crop them to the exact same size and dimensions and put them on the main page. I would do it, but I don't have the adequate software on the computer I'm at this week.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 15:13, 21 December 2006 (CST)
::I'm working on the screenshots.--[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 16:17, 21 December 2006 (CST)

::::::Can you try getting a better Daniel one as well? I must admit he looks a little bit dopey the way this screenshot came out and also it cuts off the top of his head which makes it worse. [[User:71.224.243.78|71.224.243.78]] 21:49, 21 December 2006 (CST)

The problem with finding good Daniel pictures is that in virtually every Daniel video, he's zoomed in one his face so tightly that you can't help cutting some of him off. I actually didn't want to use a picture from that video because he doesn't usually dress that way, but it's one of the best framed videos, and that particular frame is also the of the moments he comes closest to smiling. Daniel's a rather somber fellow, you may have noticed, and if I wanted a picture of him with his nose shoved against the camera and an angry look on his face, I would have had my pick. ; ) --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 14:26, 22 December 2006 (CST)

== New page is looking good ==

First, I love the new character box with their pictures. I would like to see that expanded to include the Creators (if they want) and I've made one for unofficial spin-offs as well. In my opinion, the Featured Articles section should be moved to the bottom.
Perhaps a special "the story so far" section could get its own prominent place on the main page, while the November 28 chat hardly deserves a place on the main page. There are only the same couple of sections in there, a whole transcript will never be compied as promised. There is very little of the actual chat in there almost a month on, and I think at this point it is hardly relevant anyway. What happened happened, and I don't think it needs a main page placement. We need to think of a way to compress the main page, if we keep adding each video like this, along with the numerous sections that are on there now, it'll end up going on forever. [[User:HyeMew|HyeMew]] 15:28, 21 December 2006 (CST)

:I don't want to sound rude, but I don't like the idea about the image box for the unofficial spinoffs. I just don't think that those spin-offs are important enough to take up such a big part of the main page. Technically, the unofficial spinoffs don't relate to the Breeinverse, so why should they take up a prominant part on the main page? If we include pictures for the unofficial spinoffs, we should also probably include pictures for Bree's parents, Lucy, the Watcher, Deacon, and maybe even Bree's stuffed animals. Understand what I'm saying? The unofficial spinoffs just don't seem important enough to have their pictures included on the main page. --[[User:TheNunOwnedGoat|Andy]] 21:48, 21 December 2006 (CST)

::I see what you're saying, though one must admit cassieiswatching and NikkiB at least have both had a much bigger impact on the Breeniverse (you used the term incorrectly, the Breeniverse includes all things including unofficial) when it comes to fan talk, reaction, involvement, etc. than Lucy, Bree's Parents, or any Deacon ever did. While those three are official canon characters, if one speaks impact-wise, than some of the unofficial (though maybe secretly official?) spin-offs are far more important. (Also, if you are still going to list important spin-offs on the main page in the new one, as the format has so far suggested, why NOT use an image box as well? I think it looks spiffier and don't see why such a thing can't be installed for all applicatable categories). [[User:HyeMew|HyeMew]] 21:52, 21 December 2006 (CST)

:::I think that having a box for anything besides the four main characters (and maybe at some point videos and news) is unesasary and just makes the main page more cluttered. I don't know, just my humble opinion--[[User:76.170.25.68|76.170.25.68]] 11:08, 22 December 2006 (CST)

::::The box just takes up more space. The whole point of the page, now that I've seen the box, is not to have a mile long scroll just to get to the bottom. It's got to look neat and concise, so boxes, though they take out some clutter of multiple links, just take up more space than one link. For example: just have a link called spin-offs as opposed to a whole box devoted to them. Just say OpAphid, instead of listing both OpAphid and Tachyon. It might take time to get up portals for all those things, or whatever there called (my tech talk is really not fluent,) but I think in the end it would be worth it. Do away with unnecessary links!--[[User:Demosthenesdown|Demosthenesdown]] 11:15, 22 December 2006 (CST)

:::::In my opinion, a box listed horizontally, rather than verticle listings of "Bree's room, Daniel's room, Gemma's flat, Jonas's house, Bree's religion, Thelema, Dendera, blahblah" ends up taking up less room than the more room you contend it does. But also I expect the new front page to be rid of that inane list of things related to Bree's religion. How about a horizontal box with components of Bree's life, one box is religion and links to a page listing all those various related-to-religion things, another box is locations and goes to a page listing the locations and their links, and so on. I don't see how horizontal boxes take up more room than veritcle lists of sometimes 5-8 terms. [[User:HyeMew|HyeMew]] 12:18, 22 December 2006 (CST)

:::Does it matter what's had an impact and what hasn't? Although the LG15 community went nuts over things like cassieiswatching and Nikki Bower, they haven't affected the actual story yet. To me, making the spin-offs so prominant is basically getting off-topic. As for me using Breeniverse wrong, sorry... I'm not down with all the hip, new LG15 lingo... but according to the [[Breeniverse]] LGpedia page, it defines everything ''within'' the project and anything else that can be considered "real" in Bree's world - and in Bree's world, cassieiswatching is not real... and that's how I used the term.--[[User:TheNunOwnedGoat|Andy]] 11:31, 22 December 2006 (CST)

I have some things to say about this, but basically I think I concur with Andy, and will expand on my thoughts in "[[Talk:Main_Page/redesign#Subheadings|Subheadings]]" below. --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 14:31, 22 December 2006 (CST)

== Box at top? ==

Trying out some different ideas for the box at the top. I can't get the colors to match, but I think it's because I'm using MS Paint instead of photoshop. I think if we add the images Leftcorner.JPG and Rightcorner.JPG after editing them in photoshop we can get the colors to mesh seemlessly.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 00:55, 22 December 2006 (CST)

:Okay, I'm done playing with this box for the evening. I moved it directly above the main boxes. I was thinking that maybe we could do without the introductory text on the main page, and just have the page start with this box. I think that would be about the biggest step we could take to shortening the page. We could also add something in that intro box like -- "if you're new to wikis, click here" and it would take you to a new [[LGPedia:Welcome]] page. What does everybody think of the general idea?--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 01:12, 22 December 2006 (CST)

::I concur, the box, not the text. *applause* --[[User:76.170.25.68|76.170.25.68]] 11:09, 22 December 2006 (CST)

==Subheadings==

I'm refering to the currently light-blue boxes that say things like "Official ARG" or "The Creators" etc. You know what I'm talking about? Okay, well - I think we need to get rid of them. I think that we need to create pages similar to the [[Characters]] page for every area, and then that column needs to contain only those links. The reason is that I think the main page needs to be more like a portal or table of contents rather than lists to specific articles. For instance, if underneath the bloggers box, you had links to "LG15 Staff," "Bree's Religion," "Locations," "Unofficial Spin-offs," etc. the page would be much more condensed and easier to navigate. If nobody objects, I'd like to create these pages and link to them on the redesign page sometime soon. --[[User:TheNunOwnedGoat|Andy]] 11:55, 22 December 2006 (CST)

:Okay, I think we discussed it up above somewhere, but a lot of us seem to think that the best thing to do with the main page is to make it considerably smaller. The page will be much more user-friendly and aesthetically pleasing if needs little or no scrolling to wiew the information. As Andy says, each of those subheadings could be made into a page, and on the main page, we replace them with a link. Actually, we'd even go further, replacing several sections with a single link. I like "LG15 Staff", or maybe even "Behind the scenes", which would link to a page that had subsections of links and maybe short blurbs on the Creators, the production staff, and the cast (as opposed to the characters they play). Then we could have a link to [[Breeniverse]], which many have been saying should be a much larger article; we could make the article start with the basic definition (pretty much as it now stands) and then subsections of links to related topics, such as locations, info on Bree's religion, the timeline page and the story so far page. We could also include a link to the official characters page here, as technically, they're part of the Breeniverse. Then we'd also have a link to a page on spin-offs, which we maight expande to include even some of the more minor spinoffs in a simple list. And we'd have a link to [[AphidPedia]], although we might not label the link that way, as it might be confusing to newcomers. ]

:Now, on the second column, instead of a list of all videos, there could be a list of news items like we have on this page, that would include the latest video releases of LG15, OpAphid, and maybe a few of the more prominent spinoffs, along with announcements of important events related to the series. At the bottom or the top of the column, there would be a link to a list of videos. I think that would be the best design. --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 14:47, 22 December 2006 (CST)

::I agree with both Brucker and Andy, the best way to do it is to have subsections or headings. As far as I can tell the whole point is to make the thing usuable, and having confusing lists of Spin-Offs listed in boxes akin to those of official characters, and OpAphid, the official spinoff if you will, listed just like anything else, it gets very confusing. So I'm all for making these aditions, after Christmas i guess.--[[User:76.170.25.68|76.170.25.68]] 00:42, 25 December 2006 (CST)

:::I created a [[Behind The Scenes]] page for the creators, production staff, and primary cast members. It definietly needs some work (well, not work necissarily - jazzing up, I suposse) - a better introduction would be nice, for instance... plus, it looks a little drab. I also added [[Bukanator]] to the list of characters as an "ambigious mystery person". So, we can remove the entire production staff area and replace it as a single link to the [[Behind The Scenes]] page, and Bukanator's section can also be removed. I'd like to do some more, but I don't know if I have time right now, later perhaps. --[[User:TheNunOwnedGoat|Andy]] 11:03, 28 December 2006 (CST)

== "vid" template ==

Good thinking, JayHenry! That'll help standardize the look. --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 16:25, 28 December 2006 (CST)

Even better! I set it up so you can simply copy the information from the [[Template:blog3]] into [[Template:vid]] and it will format correctly on the main page. Standardized and easy!--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 16:58, 28 December 2006 (CST)
:Ooo! VERY cool! I was also thinking about the [[Template:Event]], that it might be nice to have a few simple icon choices to go with it, such as a chat icon for a chat event, etc. Know what I mean? --[[User:Brucker|Brucker]] 18:48, 28 December 2006 (CST)
::I uploaded some icons, I'm not sure if they're usable, me not being, as I've said before, very tech savy. Use em if you like, or if you dont like, dont. also a Featured Article Star. FA_Star.png Chat.png and Newvideo.png --[[User:Demosthenesdown|Demosthenesdown]] 20:37, 28 December 2006 (CST)

:::It just occurred to me that this might look sorta silly on those fairly rare occasions where there's more than one event or video in a day. I think we can get around this using conditional formatting, have an option to not include the date. But it's too late, so I'll have to do it tomorrow.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 01:53, 29 December 2006 (CST)

== Changed Lots On the Left Column ==

Hope nobody minds, but I figured that it would be better just to '''do''' something that we seem to agree on, rather than screwing around describing everything before it happens. I think we're dealing with a relatively small group of people who are very interested in working on the new main page, so I think it's pointless to have major discussions on everything instead of just doing it.

That being said, I changed a lot of stuff on the left hand column, under the encycolpedia heading. I removed ''all'' of the subheadings and somehow moved the information in a list of links underneath the bloggers table. By doing this, I seriously shortened up this column and right now it's equal with the latest developments... so, if we maintain the size of the latest developments, it should look pretty nice (speaking of which - we need to determine what qualifies as a latest development: for example, does a new Nikki Bower video count?).

I moved the music and related sites to the new [[Behind The Scenes]] page, and I'm about to create a [[lonelygirl15.com Site Features]] page with links to the forum, chat room, LGpedia, and video list pages. I was initially going to put that as a section on the Behind The Scenes page, but I figured it should be more prominant. Also: I'm going to cleanup the unofficial spinoffs page, since it seems the more prominant spinoffs aren't included (presumably since they were already listed on the main page). I also think that we need to add some spaces between the latest video and other news, because it looks too blotched together (in my opinion).

Other than that... I don't know what else needs to be done? Obviously, the top section needs to be removed. And then... what else? Should we put it to a vote and see if everyone else likes it? And if it's well-accepted... make it the main page?

Woot. I'm excited. --[[User:TheNunOwnedGoat|Andy]] 22:00, 28 December 2006 (CST)

:I'm excited too. I think this page is almost ready for prime time. As for [[lonelygirl15.com Site Features]] you can certainly have links from both the main page and the [[Behind The Scenes]] page. If we're all happy with the LGPedia main page redesign, we should probably run it by TWJaniak, make sure the Creators are okay with it, and then take it live. I say we give it until Jan 3? That will be just three weeks from when we started the redesign. Since it's a Holiday that will give us time to get input from a few more editors who've been away.--[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] 01:51, 29 December 2006 (CST)

=Just One More Thing... Featured Articles (Again)=
So if, no when, this thing is up, is the FA just going to be a randomly selected artcle? Or do we have to go through a whole process. Because, though as an example the FA box is great, i dont think Breebrows or Brucker really qualify. If the FA isnt going to just be a randomly selected page, then we should probably work on that as well. But the new page, shortened et. all looks great. Spiffy, if you ask me... --[[User:76.170.25.68|76.170.25.68]] 02:12, 29 December 2006 (CST)

Talk:Main Page/redesign

2006-12-25T06:42:57Z

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Talk:Main Page/redesign

2006-12-22T17:09:16Z

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2006-12-22T17:08:24Z

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{{cleanup}}
[[Image:bree.jpg|right|thumb|200px|lonelygirl15 in one of her video blogs.]]
'''lonelygirl15''' is a fictional [[vlog|video blog]] that came to international attention via [[YouTube]], a popular video sharing website. The central character is a YouTube user of the same name, although she is commonly known as '''[[Bree]]'''.
'''
The character achieved massive popularity with her series of videos, which acquired over 15 million total views. But after viewers grew suspicious (see [[Lonelygirl15 (production)#Revelations of fictionality|Initial speculation]]), lonelygirl15 was exposed as a fictitious character played by [[New Zealand]] actress [[Jessica Lee Rose]]. An interview with The New York Times then revealed the series creators, [[Ramesh Flinders]], a screenwriter and film-maker from Marin County, California, and [[Miles Beckett]], a surgical residency dropout-turned-film-maker.

The series, which began June 16, 2006 is still running, with new videos appearing regularly.

==Theme and plot==
The central themes of their video blogs are:

* Unrequited love/romantic confusion - Bree is unsure of how to react when her friend Daniel confesses that he 'likes her'.
* Rebellion against parenting - Bree is homeschooled by parents who she implies are also strictly religious.
* Forbidden experimentation - her parents are apparently unaware of her video blogs.
* The Occult - Bree has a picture of [[Aleister Crowley]] in her bedroom, and she is involved in preparing for a 'ceremony'.

There are also other recurring motifs in the videos. For example, the phrase "Proving Science Wrong" is repeated on many occasions, often in reference to her spirited science experiments with Daniel.

In the blog entry "[[Swimming!]]" Bree refers to an old friend named [[Cassie]]. Since a second female character was listed in the project's initial casting call, the character is expected to appear at some point. Some videos called [[Cassieiswatching]] have appeared on YouTube, however the lonelygirl15 creators claim to be unconnected. [http://www.lonelygirl15.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=718]

In one episode, the family's religion is revealed as the [[Denderah|Order of Denderah]] and "Denderah" is one of the keyword tags on the blog. Bree is learning the [[Enochian|secret language]] for an upcoming ceremony.

==Revelations of fictionality==

===Initial speculation===

Several fans of lonelygirl15’s video posts began to wonder if Bree was, in fact, a real person or if the posts were part of a teaser campaign for a television show or an upcoming movie. Others felt that the blog might be part of an [[Alternate Reality Game|alternate reality game]].

[[Image:DanielLight.gif|right|thumb|200px|Daniel attempting to light a candle underneath a picture of [[Aleister Crowley]].]]

Fans pointed to small inconsistencies within the videos as evidence that the story might not be genuine.

* The website lonelygirl15.com, supposedly created by a fan, was registered in May 2006, a week or two prior to Bree actually uploading her first video.

* Bree has had several fights with Daniel, the boy in the video that supposedly does the video editing, on webcam. However, he still edits the videos and leaves the fights on video to be posted on YouTube. It should be noted that Bree has claimed to edit those particular videos, but it is still unlikely a girl who just endured real fights with her only friend would upload those fights to YouTube.

* The only mention of specific YouTube users occurred in the first postings. Thereafter, the only responses to user comments were generic and vague, e.g.: "Some of you guys were asking about ..." This theory was shown to be incorrect, or at least incorrect in reference to the episode "Bree the Cookie Monster", which cites certain comments.

* A US federal trademark [http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&entry=78957059 78957059], for the term ''lonelygirl15'' was filed on August 22, 2006, stating that it had been used in interstate commerce since May 24 2006.([http://portal.uspto.gov/external/portal/!ut/p/_s.7_0_A/7_0_1I1/.cmd/ad/.ar/sa.gov.uspto.tow.actions.DetailViewAction/.c/6_0_CH/.ce/7_0_1JJ/.p/5_0_1CH Trademark Application])

A post made at 1:41 AM on September 12, 2006 on a lonelygirl15 message board eventually broke the story, proclaiming that "Bree" was in fact an actress named [[Jessica Rose]].[http://alissabrooke.proboards56.com/index.cgi?board=jessr&action=display&thread=1158038202]

===Media reports of fictionality===

* The ''Los Angeles Times'' reported in an article dated September 8, 2006, that three lonelygirl15 fans - Shaina Wedmedyk, Chris Patterson, and an anonymous law student - set up a sting operation using IP address tracking software that showed that e-mails sent from a lonelygirl15 [[MySpace]] account were traced to the offices of [[Creative Artists Agency]] ("CAA"), a powerful Hollywood talent agency based in Beverly Hills.[http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-et-lonelygirl8sep08,0,5310001.story]

* The ''New York Times'', on September 12, 2006, confirmed that the creators of the series are represented by CAA and that CAA was one of several locations used by Flinders and Steinfeld to send emails from lonelygirl15 accounts.

* The ''Los Angeles Times'' On September 13th, 2006, featured the first interview with the creators of lonelygirl15, confirming the link between the creators and the CAA. [http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-me-lonelygirl13sep13,1,3672640.story?coll=la-headlines-entnews&track=crosspromo]

* The website Top Of The Tube, on September 12, published a video identifying the character Bree as a woman called Jessica Rose, on the basis of photographs found on the photo hosting site Photobucket.[http://topoftube.blogspot.com/2006/09/lonelygirl15-revealed-jessica-rose.html][http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU8iYeAzL1U] The website also revealed Jessica Rose as an "aspiring actress" from New Zealand who currently lives in [[Los Angeles]], which explains her occasional accent.

* The Silicon Valley Watcher, also on September 12, published several articles, "[http://www.siliconvalleywatcher.com/mt/archives/2006/09/the_identity_of.php The identity of LonelyGirl15] " , "[http://www.siliconvalleywatcher.com/mt/archives/2006/09/the_hunt_for_lo.php The Hunt for LonelyGirl15: Life in a blogger household...]", and "[http://www.siliconvalleywatcher.com/mt/archives/2006/09/how_the_secret.php How the secret identity of LonelyGirl15 was found]", likewise naming Jessica Rose as the actress portraying Bree, and reporting on the uncovering of the hoax.

* The website Blogger's Blog, on September 12, produced evidence that the actress' name is "Jessica Lee Rose". [http://www.bloggersblog.com/cgi-bin/bloggersblog.pl?bblog=912061]

== Admissions by Creators, and Latest Developments ==

''New York Times'' reporter Virginia Heffernan expanded on the series of revelations on September 12th out with an article which confirmed Jessica Rose's identity, and revealed the identities of her "co-conspirators", [[Ramesh Flinders]], a screenwriter and filmmaker from Marin County, Calif., and [[Miles Beckett]], a doctor-turned-filmmaker. According to Heffernan, speculation that a professional studio was used for the filming is incorrect — Bree's bedroom scenes were in fact filmed in Mr. Flinders’ very own bedroom using nothing more than a [[Logitech QuickCam]], a Web camera that retails for about $150. Software engineer Grant Steinfeld was also involved in this project, as a photographer. Amanda Solomon Goodfried, an assistant at Creative Artists Agency, assisted in their efforts to hide their identities, and a lawyer — Ms. Goodfried's father-in-law, Kenneth Goodfried — handled various legal matters. The personnel involved worked under an NDA (Non-disclosure agreement) according to Grant Steinfield. Steinfield has verified most of this information to the ''Times'', and provided photographs he took on set of Ms. Rose as proof.<ref name = NYTimes/>

The three main "creators" gave an interview to the Los Angeles Times, which appeared even later in the day on September 12.<ref name = Brainchild/> Besides Mr. Beckett and Mr. Flinders, already revealed, the third major partner was revealed as Greg Goodfried, who presumably is related to Amanda and Kenneth Goodfried, although he states that the CAA connection came "through a friend who works at the agency."<ref name = Brainchild/> [[Associated Press]] published an interview with Jessica Rose on September 14 in which she described how she had become involved in the project and stated that she would continue working on it.<ref name = "JessicaRoseInterview" >{{cite web | url = http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060914/ap_on_hi_te/online_mystery_solved | title = Sudden fame amazes 'Lonelygirl15' star | work = Associated Press | accessdate = 2006-09-15 }}</ref> In addition to the Associated Press interview, she also [http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1540910/20060914/index.jhtml?headlines=true appeared on MTV News on September 14th] alongside Ramesh Flinders.

On September 13, the site Top of the Tube began circulating the trailer for Jessica Rose's first film ''Dearly Beloved'' directed by [[Leah Salvesen]] in which she starred as a distressed bride-to-be.<ref>{{cite web | title = Exclusive: lonelygirl15 a.k.a. Jessica Rose in Dearly Beloved trailer | url = http://topoftube.blogspot.com/2006/09/exclusive-lonelygirl15-aka-jessica-rose.html | work = Top of the Tube | date = [[2006-09-13]] | accessdate = 2006-09-13 }}</ref>

On the evening of Thursday, September 14th, Jessica Rose made a surprise appearance on ''[[The Tonight Show]]'' with [[Jay Leno]]. During her brief appearance she stated her name, where she was from, her actual age, and that she was not lonely anymore. Following her last remark, [[Tucker Carlson]] came out on stage and music was cued. The two began dancing together until the commercial break. Jessica Rose (referred to as Lonelygirl15) also appeared on the Internet talk-show [[Tom Green Live]] on September 29, 2006 in which she danced with Danielbeast and friends while the band [[Reel Big Fish]] played live music in host [[Tom Green]]'s living room studio<ref>[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UuiGWgKxuDg Video of LonelyGirl15 appearance on Tom Green Live]</ref>.

The actor behind Danielbeast is named Yousef Abu-Taleb. He was discussed by name by Ramesh Flinders and Jessica Rose during their September 14 MTV News appearance. Photos of Abu-Taleb from outside of the lonelygirl15 project have started to appear, and were compiled on YouTube into a video scrapbook called [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_A2EqFsLgU "Danielbeast Exposed".]

Since the fictitious nature of lonelygirl15 has been revealed, the storyline continues to develop via new videos posted to both [[YouTube]] and [[Revver]]. The continuation of the series fulfills the promise that the authors made in a New York Times article, stating that they will continue the story of lonelygirl15 and Danielbeast despite the public's awareness that the blog is fictional.<ref name = Applause>{{cite news | url = http://screens.blogs.nytimes.com/?p=77 | title = Applause for lonelygirl15, and DVD Extras | publisher = [[New York Times]] | date = [[2006-09-12]] | accessdate = 2006-09-13 | work = Screens | author = [[Virginia Heffernan|Heffernan, Virginia]] }}</ref>

From September 9, 2006 onwards, lonelygirl15.com has served the series from [[Revver]], a service that allows video creators to make money from their videos by having ads automatically inserted after their videos. When the creators came forward on September 13, 2006, Revver was publicized [2] as the official home of lonelygirl15. Recently, videos have appeared on lonelygirl15.com significantly in advance of appearing on youtube.com. Internet traffic comparisons may bear out that additional traffic is being directed to lonelygirl15.com.

The online star was recently hired by the United Nations to fight poverty through an online anti-poverty video. Rose will be playing her infamous LonelyGirl15 role as she sits by herself in her bedroom talking to the camera. This time, however, she will be talking about the antipoverty cause rather than her boyfriend troubles. The anti-poverty video has been posted on YouTube in the hopes of sparking a buzz online for a call around the world to “stand up against poverty.” The online videos are part of a broader ad campaign designed by WPP Group’s ad agency Y&R. Y&R will be working with the United Nation’s Millennium campaign to front the campaign and is now available for all to see.

==Production Techniques==
[[Image:Lighting the set.jpg]]

This picture shows what appears to be [[Miles Beckett]] lighting the set with relative simple equipment.

[[Miles Beckett]] also appears to participate in the video editing.

The video editing style uses frequent [[jump cuts]].

[[Cast]]

== Trivia ==
* The series was developed under the working title ''The Children of Anchor Cove'' [http://www.northjersey.com/page.php?qstr=eXJpcnk3ZjczN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXkxNjcmZmdiZWw3Zjd2cWVlRUV5eTY5OTI4MTEmeXJpcnk3ZjcxN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXk3].

* lonelygirl15 has various signature items/props that appear in its episodes. Recurring props include a pink feather boa, a safari hat, and her beloved puppet Purple Monkey (a.k.a. "P-Monkey").

* There are references to the occultic philosophy of [[Thelema]]; on the lonelygirl15.com website, the greek letters θέλημα ("Thelema") appear at the bottom of the page, along with three unicursal hexagrams on the header bar, and the phrase "Site design by Darbyite Design" at the bottom.

* The total number of views in the lonelygirl15 series is estimated to be about 28,000,000 views.

==Chat Room==
Fans of the show can now chat about it in the [[LG15 Chat room]].

==References==

* Richards, Jonathan; "[http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-2319463,00.html Worldwide fame for a lonely girl]", 2006-08-19
* Glaser, Mark; "[http://www.pbs.org/mediashift/2006/09/lonelygirl15_outedmatt_foremsk.html Matt Foremski’s Sleuthing Leads to Jessica Rose]", 2006-09-12

==External links==

;Official sites
* [http://www.lonelygirl15.com/ Lonelygirl15.com]
* [http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=lonelygirl15 YouTube: Lonelygirl15]

;Related official sites
* [http://www.myspace.com/lonelygurl15 MySpace: Lonelygirl15]
* [http://www.myspace.com/danielbeast Danielbeast on MySpace, complete with "Behind the Scenes" blog] (maintained by an administrator of the official message forum, but approved by Yousef Abu Taleb)

;Articles

* [http://www.caffeinemarketing.com/online-marketing/lonelygirl15-hired-by-united-nations/ "LonelyGirl15 Hired By The United Nations"], ''CaffeineMarketing.com''
* [http://msnbc.msn.com/id/14816502/wid/11915829&GT1=8596 "Creators of Lonelygirl15 blogs go public"], ''MSNBC.com''
* [http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/index.php?menuID=2&subID=903 Lonely Girl 15, real name Jessica Rose, exposed as fake. Published 9/12 4pm GMT]
* http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/internet/09/12/online.mystery.ap/index.html
* [http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1540910/20060914/index.jhtml?headlines=true Jessica Rose Interview (print and video) on MTV]Jessica Rose on MTV larger interview, also with "DanielBeast" (Video not available to those outside the U.S.)
* [http://www.eurekastreet.com.au/article.aspx?aeid=1762 "LonelyGirl15 exposes the Net's illogical sense of community"], article on the deception of the lonelygirl15 project''www.eurekastreet.com.au''