colbertnationgirl wrote:What is with all this defending Glenn? He broke the rules, he was fired. End of story.
we don't know that he broke any rules. and we don't know that he was fired.
I think this is the speculation The Creators meant to stop with their statement. Now, I'm not defending Glenn, nor am I condemning him. I simply think the trial by public opinion needs to stop. If he's guilty of any wrongdoing, I'm sure it will be dealt with appropriately. If he's not, then all we've done by discussing the allegations against him is ruin an innocent man's reputation. I think *that* is the point that Hyemew has been attempting to make all along.
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What worries me is that some people are quick to defend someone not on the basis of whether or not the wrongdoing happened, but solely on how much of an impact he had on the show.
I feel like people are saying the equivalent of, "Aaron Sorkin is innocent of his drug charges! He's the writer of The West Wing, he must be innocent!"
Note that I'm still not standing up here saying guilty/innocent - not for me to decide, and if it was, I'd say "no comment." I just think people are basing their decisions completely on emotions and that's where things get silly and/or dangerous.
If the ARG becomes more prominent and "central," then I believe to make sure casual watchers don't get lost is to have the characters themselves become more involved in it, more knowledgeable and more elaborate in explaining how it works (in character, obviously).
colbertnationgirl wrote:What is with all this defending Glenn? He broke the rules, he was fired. End of story.
The Creators have Rules? I doubt they even have an employee manual! Generally, though, yes, it the creators' decision. its their show.
My point has been that Glenn has made some good contributions from LG15 APART from the ARG stuff (which i don't care about).
the rules that are generallly being discussed by people on here are the basic guidelines pm's for ARGs are to follow
IF (and I mean IF) Glenn did what he is accused of doing...he defiantely broke the rules. Actually the biggest rule that PM's could break, was broken IF glenn did what he accused
Do not contact you players UNLESS there is a safety or convienience concern.
Alright, I have steered clear of all the commotion about this Glenn situation for the past few days. But, reading through this thread, I feel as though people are calming down and being much more civil.
So I will state my opinion. Please don't try to start an argument with me because I won't respond, thus you will be wasting your time.
I don't care what Glenn did or did not do. I completely understand why the Creators do, and I will trust that their decision will be based on just and reasonable evidence. But honestly, it doesn't affect me at all, until now.
I do not know exactly what Glenn did or did not do; all that I do know, is that I sure as hell want him to stay. I love the Creators. I practically worship them. I spend hours upon hours of my time reading this forum and talking to the other fans. I love the people on here and I respect the Creators immensely for keeping me interested in this series for so long.
Not to offend anyone, but if Glenn leaves this team, I suspect I will be leaving this forum. After looking at which videos Glenn took part in and which he did not, I have lost my faith in the Creators without him. I have very little hope for our original Creators to be able to make LG15 as good as it has been for much longer.
Glenn, though he may be an amateur, has an unbelievable aptitude for writing and directing. He has added the mystery, suspense, thrill, and twists that I have for so long yearned to find in LG15. Ever since CiW left, and the trio went on the run, the story became more treacherously monotonous with each video. But, since the canonization of OpAphid and the welcoming of Glenn on board, my hope has not only been sparked, but renewed and multiplied. Without Glenn, this series will become an online diary of adolescents with raging hormones, teen angst, and ultimately a bunch of orphans running around the country with men in black suits and sun glasses lurking ominously around the corner, with the occasional good-looking woman appearing and disappearing after being outted as evil.
Please, don't do that to your show, Creators.
"Beneath this mask there is more than flesh. Beneath this mask there is an idea, Mr. Creedy, and ideas are bulletproof."
-- V For Vendetta <3
Linc wrote:What worries me is that some people are quick to defend someone not on the basis of whether or not the wrongdoing happened, but solely on how much of an impact he had on the show.
i think there is some conflation of these concepts going on. i myself am not defending wrongdoing if it happened. because there has been tons of idle speculation. if glenn's contributions were utter shite, i would probably care less. but videos like "bree phone home" and "drinking problems" (both "vidplay by Glenn Rubenstein") had good non-ARG payoffs.
Killthesmiley wrote:the rules that are generallly being discussed by people on here are the basic guidelines pm's for ARGs are to follow
IF (and I mean IF) Glenn did what he is accused of doing...he defiantely broke the rules. Actually the biggest rule that PM's could break, was broken IF glenn did what he accused ... Do not contact you players UNLESS there is a safety or convienience concern.
thanks for the clarification, KTS. i doubt the creators were imposing those rules on glenn, since they didn't even know what an ARG was a few months ago. but it helps me understand things a bit more.
Linc wrote:What worries me is that some people are quick to defend someone not on the basis of whether or not the wrongdoing happened, but solely on how much of an impact he had on the show.
I feel like people are saying the equivalent of, "Aaron Sorkin is innocent of his drug charges! He's the writer of The West Wing, he must be innocent!"
Note that I'm still not standing up here saying guilty/innocent - not for me to decide, and if it was, I'd say "no comment." I just think people are basing their decisions completely on emotions and that's where things get silly and/or dangerous.
If the ARG becomes more prominent and "central," then I believe to make sure casual watchers don't get lost is to have the characters themselves become more involved in it, more knowledgeable and more elaborate in explaining how it works (in character, obviously).
I believe the crux of it would be better summed up using this analogy:
"Aaron Sorkin may or may not be guilty of his drug charges. He is, however, the writer of The West Wing, and since I like his work I hope he can continue it."
janesalteredstates wrote:I believe the crux of it would be better summed up using this analogy:
"Aaron Sorkin may or may not be guilty of his drug charges. He is, however, the writer of The West Wing, and since I like his work I hope he can continue it."
I could be wrong.
I think your analogy is how it should be, and Linc's is how it is.
That was the weirdest display of geekdom that I have ever seen in my entire life.
ApotheosisAZ wrote:While I can't speak for HyeMew, I believe that what Hye intended to be discussed here was a call for a quick and fair resolution of the issue.
Those who wish to express their admiration for Glenn's work can find that topic here.
I also continue to add my hope that the issue will be decided speedily and fairly.
I too hope for this whole situation to be resolved fairly and quickly, and I mean no offense to you Apo, but the thread is called "Making a Case For Glenn." I really do believe that the quality of Glenn's work and his contributions that he has made apply here. I realise that sometimes it does just sound as though we are ranting about how great we think he is, but (for me at least) it was merely to show why I don't think he should be let go. But I will echo you and say that I cannot speak for HyeMew.
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ApotheosisAZ wrote:While I can't speak for HyeMew, I believe that what Hye intended to be discussed here was a call for a quick and fair resolution of the issue.
Those who wish to express their admiration for Glenn's work can find that topic here.
I also continue to add my hope that the issue will be decided speedily and fairly.
You've got it completely. I want a fair and QUICK resolution to the issue.
Accusations that we are overlooking serious wrongdoing because we like his work is totally off-base. Instead, we believe that while there were some ethical breaches with the ARG, which Glenn is now off of, we do not feel what has been released should result in him being completely kicked off the show. Furthermore, I feel that speculation over what Glenn did has run and HAS BEEN ALLOWED to run completely wild and the allegations have been blown totally out of proportion.
I totally understand there might be more evidence that could come to light that only the Creators know. There is no proof, and I totally believe that what has been released is all there is, but there is no way to know. Only the Creators do. And so far after a week's time all they can tell us is the throw-away line of "they are still collecting evidence." I find it hard to believe it has taken them a week to collect all this other "evidence", whatever it may be, if there even is any. Their lack of a statement for a week has caused speculation to run not just about what Glenn might have done but that he might have done things wrong beyond the initial allegations which will come to light when the Creators release their final statement. Glenn's reputation is essentially being held hostage by the Creators who seem to be doing nothing but using stalling tactics.
And I believe we need to ask ourselves WHY?
Hyemew, you and I haven't spoke a whole lot (if at all) and I have to say that your original post was completely well thought out and well written. Kudos to you.
I agree completely with everything you said. In my eyes, a decision as already been made. As a human, its almost impossible to not jump the gun and say "This is what we are going to do". I certainly hope that the creators realize that they are new to this as well, and although trying to be "diplomatic" they have to be analyzing the FACTS and informing the public with the decision that will be made. We are talking about a guy who gave up his life for the purpose of this ARG. Luckily for GLenn, he was welcomed with open arms by the creators to join their TEAM. To mean, a TEAM discusses situations, and comes to a conclusion based on the facts they have, not forum specualtion. in my opinion, The creators are simply stalling in hopes that Glenn gives up, tucks tail and runs. Opaphid, Tachyon and LG15 needs Glenn.
I watched some YT videos last night from that ARG convention thing. It was obvious that the creators enjoyed Glenn and wanted him to work with them. Even based on prior statements I have seen on the forums, they respected him, respected US (the forum members) as participants, and were more than willing to make statements when it was positive and benefits all. So now I think it is time for the creators to have respect for all parties involved and make the statement we are all waiting for. Not some generic "we are reviewing the situation" statement.
The forums have been a mess for a week now. (no that isn't a slam against the mods or the ops... i can see how hard it is to keep up. one thread is merged 7 more pop up) Rumors, assumptions, slander....
We need answers.
And again. this is MY opinion... and in no way am i speaking for anyone else.
colbertnationgirl wrote:What is with all this defending Glenn? He broke the rules, he was fired. End of story.
Thanks for perfectly demonstrating exactly what I have been speaking against.
The Creators have not cleared a single thing up, and their silence only perpetuates the rumors I have been hearing that in fact he HAS been fired. This is despite the fact there does not seem to be anything creditable besides what has been published on the OpAphid blog.
We as fans and Glenn are owed better than this. Either the Creators HAVE evidence that makes Glenn worthy of being fired (though it doesn't seem like anything was actually done to deserve) that or he didn't. This leads me to believe that there is an ulterior motive to their constant stalling, at the very least they could tell people if any of this speculation is warranted, as they are the only ones besides Glenn who knows the whole truth and have everything. If the evidence they have now is enough to make Glenn appear guilty of things far worse than getting sent a nude picture, then tell us. If the Creators don't have that, then TELL us. This stalling is WHOLLY UNPROFESSIONAL and we as fans should know when we are being toyed with and oppose it vehemently.
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